[CryptoParty] Summing up Twitter conversations about TeleTrust Sponsorship

Hauke Laging hauke.laging at openpgp-schulungen.de
Thu Jul 18 22:29:59 GMT 2013


Am Do 18.07.2013, 23:54:19 schrieb Samuel Carlisle:
> @Hauke and others, have you now seen the reaction on twitter and also
> IRC to this offer from of funding? Do you still think we should put
> something on the wiki to advertise this? I really hope not...

I was not in IRC. I am not a friend of twitter. I don't think that a 
rdidiculously low text size limit is a positive factor for the quality of an 
analysis or an argument.

I did not suggest to advertise Teletrust on the web site but "to have a 
positive list of offers which most of us would be willing to accept".


> I think it is abundantly clear that TeleTrust are associated with
> Microsoft, RIM, BND, (and the list only gets worse... feel free to dig
> more) so these guys are *not* really friends of Cryptoparty- read some
> of the comments and guidance coming from twitter:

I don't get the point. SELinux is from the NSA. Where are the people who 
refuse to use it for that reason, how many are they? I do not think they are 
interested in that but even if US and UK government decided to spend money for 
supporting Cryptoparties it would IMHO be stupid not to take it. The value of 
money is a question of its target not of its source. Assessing the source is 
political debate. I just read on this list that the Cryptoparty community 
should stay away from political debate.

Assume the BND itself would teach the public about crypto. Would that be good 
or bad? Or is it possible that this depends on what exactly they would teach 
and what not (like with every Cryptoparty)?


> @qbi @samthetechie Some groups received emails from TeleTrusT saying
> stuff like "we give you money if you don't focus on Open Source".

I would not accept that. But that is quite different from what I heard of 
them. The proposal itself seems ridiculous to me. Who would expect Cryptoparty 
people to accept that? 


> @qbi @samthetechie If TeleTrusT wants to make something useful they
> should do some funding of crypto OSS (i.e. by paying Werner or others)

So who can explain to me why and how the Cryptoparty idea (or single events) 
could be damaged by support with the "wrong" money BUT GnuPG couldn't? Is 
Werner a morally higher person than us? Can we be bought but he can't? Or is 
he more clever than us so that he would realize that someone tries to buy him 
but we wouldn't? I am not going to think that low on myself.


> @qbi @fukami @samthetechie I'm not entirely sure you'd want an
> organisation with MS and RIM being member sponsoring cryptopartys

Without having a single argument everyone is for my part to believe whatever 
he wants to. I just hope that emotion alone does not have a big influence on 
others.


> The conclusion seems to be that TeleTrust can not be involved at the
> parties to sponse any drinks or have adverts or anything

The first thing I added to the discussion was that I think spending money for 
drinks is a bad idea anyway. I don't think that the events themselves have a 
money problem at all. This is even more true now that Cryptoparty is a 
recognized label.


> could indirectly (and very very effectively) support #cryptoparty by
> simply donating to OTR: http://www.cypherpunks.ca/otr/donate.php
> GNUpg: http://www.gnupg.org/misc/donations.en.html … Tor:
> https://www.torproject.org/donate/donate

Sure they could. But to my knowledge none of these projects is in a phase of 
unclear success whereas I hear statements like "In two months the Cryptoparty 
hype can be over".

None of those projects will make the permanent success of the Cryptoparty 
movement more probable by getting better itself.

For all I know the amount of money they can spend is limited anyway. So the 
practical solution is: Those who believe that money from a disliked source 
should be avoided simply avoid it. Don't ask for it and refuse it if offered.

But if you want to criticize others for behaving differently then I would 
strongly demand something that looks like an argument instead of pure emotion.


CU

Hauke
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